你对加拿大最近的禁枪令持什么看法

Kerrigan

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加拿大有手枪也不能放家里,特定职业例外。放个猎枪规矩也很多。

朋友你先去调查了解一下法规再发言吧。要不然咱们没法交流。
 
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你找来看看。

枪支拥有率和谋杀率之间,没有正相关,而更多的时候是负相关。

建议你读一下这个,由加拿大与美国两个著名犯罪学家牵头,十几名美加澳教授专家合著,发表在著名的《哈佛大学法律与公共政策期刊》上的论文。洋洋洒洒40多页,数据取自加拿大、美国、澳大利亚政府,以及联合国等机构的档案。

Kates, D. B., & Mauser, G. (2007). Would Banning Firearms Reduce Murder and Suicide? Harvard Journal of Law & Public Policy, 30(2), 649–694.

1589242236076.png

美国同时拥有高拥枪率高谋杀率,但是你不能说拥枪率和谋杀率这两个变量有着因果关系,因为这里面有很多混淆变量(Confounding Variable),比如种族不平等,黑帮毒品泛滥,贫富差距过大,单亲家庭问题,辍学儿童问题,城中村问题,执法效率问题等等。再重复一遍,双高不意味着因果关系!就像阿尔伯塔同时拥有石油和畜牧业的高产,并不意味着,是石油养育了牛,或是牛粪产生了石油!这是最基本的统计学常识,如果还不明白,可以把公共政策问题先放一放,回学校补课。

拥枪率高的国家还包含瑞士、法国、德国、丹麦、芬兰、瑞典、希腊、挪威、奥地利、加拿大等等,多得超乎你的想象,而这些国家却没有美国遇到的高谋杀率的问题。俄罗斯倒是拥枪率不高,而谋杀率却高得惊人!为什么科学论文会颠覆你的想象?因为你的常识基础是错误的。这不怨你,上流左派所控制的主流媒体一直在散布谎言,动机就不说了。由没有专业背景的小白参与国家决策,轻信富人所控制的媒体的宣传洗脑,这是民主制度的一个弊端。

1589243792941.png
 
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朋友你先去调查了解一下法规再发言吧。要不然咱们没法交流。



2 (1) These Regulations do not apply to members of any of the following classes of persons who are acting in the course of their duties or for the purposes of their employment:

  • (a) peace officers;
  • (b) members of the Canadian Forces or of the armed forces of a state other than Canada who are attached or seconded to any of the Canadian Forces;
  • (c) persons training to become police officers or peace officers under the control and supervision of
    • (i) a police force, or
    • (ii) a police academy or similar institution designated by the Attorney General of Canada or the lieutenant governor in council of a province;
  • (d) members of a visiting force, within the meaning of section 2 of the Visiting Forces Act, who are authorized under paragraph 14(a) of that Act to possess and carry explosives, ammunition and firearms;
  • (e) persons or members of a class of persons employed in the public service of Canada or by the government of a province or municipality who are prescribed by the regulations made by the Governor in Council under Part III of the Criminal Code to be public officers; and
  • (f) chief firearms officers or firearms officers.


我在这儿跟你们就叫这个真儿了,这种存储枪的方法,跟没放有啥区别,你能确保在不到1分钟内,枪出盒,弹上膛,起到你需要的威慑作用?

Storage of Restricted Firearms
6 An individual may store a restricted firearm only if

  • (a) it is unloaded;
  • (b) it is
    • (i) rendered inoperable by means of a secure locking device and stored in a container, receptacle or room that is kept securely locked and that is constructed so that it cannot readily be broken open or into, or
    • (ii) stored in a vault, safe or room that has been specifically constructed or modified for the secure storage of restricted firearms and that is kept securely locked; and
  • (c) it is not readily accessible to ammunition, unless the ammunition is stored, together with or separately from the firearm, in
    • (i) a container or receptacle that is kept securely locked and that is constructed so that it cannot readily be broken open or into, or
    • (ii) a vault, safe or room that has been specifically constructed or modified for the secure storage of restricted firearms and that is kept securely locked.

Storage of Prohibited Firearms
7 An individual may store a prohibited firearm only if

  • (a) it is unloaded;
  • (b) it is
    • (i) rendered inoperable by means of a secure locking device and stored in a container, receptacle or room that is kept securely locked and that is constructed so that it cannot readily be broken open or into, and, if the prohibited firearm is an automatic firearm that has a removable bolt or bolt-carrier, the bolt or bolt-carrier is removed and stored in a room that is different from the room in which the automatic firearm is stored, that is kept securely locked and that is constructed so that it cannot readily be broken open or into, or
    • (ii) stored in a vault, safe or room that has been specifically constructed or modified for the secure storage of prohibited firearms and that is kept securely locked; and
  • (c) it is not readily accessible to ammunition, unless the ammunition is stored, together with or separately from the firearm, in
    • (i) a container or receptacle that is kept securely locked and that is constructed so that it cannot readily be broken open or into, or
    • (ii) a vault, safe or room that has been specifically constructed or modified for the secure storage of prohibited firearms and that is kept securely locked.
 
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Kerrigan

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我觉得这个帖子是一个有很高技术含量的好帖,拥枪和禁抢两派展开了充分的讨论。

我希望真理越辩越明,让两派人都充分了解对方观点,彻底发现自己观念上的误区,然后冷静思考,对自己的立场做必要的调整。我们不求一定要说服对方认可自己,但力求让每个人都保证自己的立场与自己的内心主张和世界观是一致的,而不是受到了某种舆论的误导。
 

Kerrigan

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2 (1) These Regulations do not apply to members of any of the following classes of persons who are acting in the course of their duties or for the purposes of their employment:


(a) peace officers;
(b) members of the Canadian Forces or of the armed forces of a state other than Canada who are attached or seconded to any of the Canadian Forces;
(c) persons training to become police officers or peace officers under the control and supervision of

(i) a police force, or
(ii) a police academy or similar institution designated by the Attorney General of Canada or the lieutenant governor in council of a province;

(d) members of a visiting force, within the meaning of section 2 of the Visiting Forces Act, who are authorized under paragraph 14(a) of that Act to possess and carry explosives, ammunition and firearms;
(e) persons or members of a class of persons employed in the public service of Canada or by the government of a province or municipality who are prescribed by the regulations made by the Governor in Council under Part III of the Criminal Code to be public officers; and
(f) chief firearms officers or firearms officers.



这种存储方法,跟没放有啥区别

Storage of Restricted Firearms
6 An individual may store a restricted firearm only if


(a) it is unloaded;
(b) it is

(i) rendered inoperable by means of a secure locking device and stored in a container, receptacle or room that is kept securely locked and that is constructed so that it cannot readily be broken open or into, or
(ii) stored in a vault, safe or room that has been specifically constructed or modified for the secure storage of restricted firearms and that is kept securely locked; and

(c) it is not readily accessible to ammunition, unless the ammunition is stored, together with or separately from the firearm, in

(i) a container or receptacle that is kept securely locked and that is constructed so that it cannot readily be broken open or into, or
(ii) a vault, safe or room that has been specifically constructed or modified for the secure storage of restricted firearms and that is kept securely locked.


Storage of Prohibited Firearms
7 An individual may store a prohibited firearm only if


(a) it is unloaded;
(b) it is

(i) rendered inoperable by means of a secure locking device and stored in a container, receptacle or room that is kept securely locked and that is constructed so that it cannot readily be broken open or into, and, if the prohibited firearm is an automatic firearm that has a removable bolt or bolt-carrier, the bolt or bolt-carrier is removed and stored in a room that is different from the room in which the automatic firearm is stored, that is kept securely locked and that is constructed so that it cannot readily be broken open or into, or
(ii) stored in a vault, safe or room that has been specifically constructed or modified for the secure storage of prohibited firearms and that is kept securely locked; and

(c) it is not readily accessible to ammunition, unless the ammunition is stored, together with or separately from the firearm, in

(i) a container or receptacle that is kept securely locked and that is constructed so that it cannot readily be broken open or into, or
(ii) a vault, safe or room that has been specifically constructed or modified for the secure storage of prohibited firearms and that is kept securely locked.

有区别。简单说:

弹夹上弹,手枪在旁,一起放入床头safe。紧急状况输入密码或者扫指纹开柜,上弹夹上膛,大概3~5秒钟即可。此时歹徒还没爬上二楼。

而且,你刚才贴的那条关于storage的法律,在我和很多枪友看来,也是属于“恶法”之一。需要改进的地方多啊。
 
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有区别。简单说:

弹夹上弹,手枪在旁,一起放入床头safe。紧急状况输入密码或者扫指纹开柜,上弹夹上膛,大概3~5秒钟即可。此时歹徒还没爬上二楼。

而且,你刚才贴的那条法律,在我看来,也是属于“恶法”之一。需要改进的地方多啊。


“紧急状况输入密码或者扫指纹开柜” ---紧急情况下你距离床头safe的距离一定是你上肢能轻松够到的物理范围之内? 从发现紧急状况到成功开safe平均需要多长时间?

“上弹夹上膛” 3~5秒,可以忽略不计

闯入者能给你多长时间反应?
 

Kerrigan

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“紧急状况输入密码或者扫指纹开柜” ---紧急情况下你距离床头safe的距离一定是你上肢能轻松够到的物理范围之内? 从发现紧急状况到成功开safe平均需要多长时间?

“上弹夹上膛” 3~5秒,可以忽略不计

闯入者能给你多长时间反应?

我说的3-5秒钟,是整个的时间。包括了打开保险柜,拿出枪和弹夹,上弹夹、上膛。

你知道为什么safe放在床头吗?因为最危险的情况发生在你和家人正在休息,而歹徒破窗或者破门而入的情况下。简单估算吧,一层被破窗,歹徒就算径直走上二楼,再进入主卧,一般也需要多几秒的时间。这就给了屋主充分的反应时间,做好战斗准备。

如果你在平时白天在家的时候遇到此类事件,那么歹徒在企图闯入的时候,必然已经被你发觉,则根据具体情况,你可以有很多选择。有ADT的可以启动报警,就极大震慑了歹徒。如果你人在二层(或者在任何一层但是方便拿枪),则去拿枪自卫。如果人在一层,甚至可以翻越后院篱笆逃离然后报警……诸多选项哦。

就我家的具体情况而言,门窗都是特别加固过的。外表一点都看不出来,但是如果有人想硬闯,我估计给他二十分钟都不一定能砸得开玻璃。到时候别说上膛,我给枪上一遍枪油都够了。
 
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我在咱们村口熏肉店后面的渔猎店(关门了)看到过弩机,每看一眼都觉得心口发凉,这种冷兵器要干掉个把人绝对干脆利落一点没问题。

说到弩, 这个也不错, 在家放枪,还不如放这个。


crossbow 1.jpg






 
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我说的3-5秒钟,是整个的时间。包括了打开保险柜,拿出枪和弹夹,上弹夹、上膛。

你知道为什么safe放在床头吗?因为最危险的情况发生在你和家人正在休息,而歹徒破窗或者破门而入的情况下。简单估算吧,一层被破窗,歹徒就算径直走上二楼,再进入主卧,一般也需要多几秒的时间。这就给了屋主充分的反应时间,做好战斗准备。

如果你在平时白天在家的时候遇到此类事件,那么歹徒在企图闯入的时候,必然已经被你发觉,则根据具体情况,你可以有很多选择。有ADT的可以启动报警,就极大震慑了歹徒。如果你人在二层(或者在任何一层但是方便拿枪),则去拿枪自卫。如果人在一层,甚至可以翻越后院篱笆逃离然后报警……诸多选项哦。

就我家的具体情况而言,门窗都是特别加固过的。外表一点都看不出来,但是如果有人想硬闯,我估计给他二十分钟都不一定能砸得开玻璃。到时候别说上膛,我给枪上一遍枪油都够了。

我说的3-5秒钟,是整个的时间。包括了打开保险柜,拿出枪和弹夹,上弹夹、上膛。“--------- 我选择相信。
 
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很少参加家园的讨论,但是这个话题我想聊聊。首先我声明我是支持拥枪的,但是我认为目前加拿大的情形很不乐观。据说52%的加拿大人同意全面禁枪,而华人的比例更高。面对这次禁枪,我们只能尽力抗争。比如这个:https://petitions.ourcommons.ca/en/Petition/Details?Petition=e-2574
 

Kerrigan

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“我说的3-5秒钟,是整个的时间。包括了打开保险柜,拿出枪和弹夹,上弹夹、上膛。“--------- 我选择相信。

朋友,我不想说一些吹牛的话,没什么意思。指纹验证保险柜,全套操作对我来说3-5秒钟够了。你不妨这么想吧,就算3-5秒钟不够用,而需要10秒20秒,其实也无伤大雅。在很多时候,当歹徒企图破门而入的时候,事主已经被惊醒了。这时候时间并不是最大的问题,最大的问题是,就算给事主再多的时间,也仍然无法击倒一伙暴徒。

这时候,事主只需要一把枪。
 
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而且,你刚才贴的那条关于storage的法律,在我和很多枪友看来,也是属于“恶法”之一。需要改进的地方多啊。
这不算”恶法“。这些措施能有效防止家中的未成年人在未经许可的情况下接触到枪支,从而避免了误伤或误杀。美国多起校园枪击案中的作案枪支,就是来源于家中储存不当的合法枪支。同时,这些措施也能大大降低枪支被盗窃的概率,有效防止合法枪支向黑市流入。这些措施提高了安全性,堵住了反枪人士的嘴,一举多得。
 
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朋友,我不想说一些吹牛的话,没什么意思。指纹验证保险柜,全套操作对我来说3-5秒钟够了。你不妨这么想吧,就算3-5秒钟不够用,而需要10秒20秒,其实也无伤大雅。在很多时候,当歹徒企图破门而入的时候,事主已经被惊醒了。这时候时间并不是最大的问题,最大的问题是,就算给事主再多的时间,也仍然无法击倒一伙暴徒。

这时候,事主只需要一把枪。

闯入者也有一把枪,随时待发。发发致命。



 
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Kerrigan

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闯入者也有一把枪,随时待发。发发致命。

这一点上,你可能又是有点想当然了。闯入者能够“发发毙命”的可能性无限接近于零。事实上,业余射击爱好者的练习量一般是远大于亡命之徒的,因为亡命之徒根本没有合法身份去成为靶场会员。

更重要的是,此时你和歹徒都有枪,而你还有地利——熟悉自家环境。而如果大家听禁枪者的主张,则是赤手空拳面对歹徒的枪。到时候胜负就很明显了。
 
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很少参加家园的讨论,但是这个话题我想聊聊。首先我声明我是支持拥枪的,但是我认为目前加拿大的情形很不乐观。据说52%的加拿大人同意全面禁枪,而华人的比例更高。面对这次禁枪,我们只能尽力抗争。比如这个:https://petitions.ourcommons.ca/en/Petition/Details?Petition=e-2574

拥、禁对具体事危机件没看出来会有有任何本质区别,事主即时反应最关键。
赞成家里有枪,枪、弹药的存储方法可议。
 
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这一点上,你可能又是有点想当然了。闯入者能够“发发毙命”的可能性无限接近于零。事实上,业余射击爱好者的练习量一般是远大于亡命之徒的,因为亡命之徒根本没有合法身份去成为靶场会员。

更重要的是,此时你和歹徒都有枪,而你还有地利——熟悉自家环境。而如果大家听禁枪者的主张,则是赤手空拳面对歹徒的枪。到时候胜负就很明显了。

好吧。你说的都对,仅仅从理论上来讲 :LOL:
 

霜岳

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这个话题讨论异常激烈
很遗憾我没有事先预告这次节目
否则说不定会有热心网友参加我们的聊天
让更多的受众可以听见你的声音
下次再有类似的争议性话题
我一定提前预告
欢迎感兴趣的网友报名
 

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